One way Roads - thoughts..

[Chris]

Morning all,

I've been playing with the new one-way roads feature of the patch....
and have the following suggestions - some of which may be easier to
implement than others...

I'm basically using the one way roads to create sort of
motorways/divided highways.

1. Vehicles have a speed advantage of using one way streets - perhaps
+10%

2. Vehicles do not stop overtaking at junctions, tunnels, bridges,
corners, etc!

3. Vehicles prefer to use one way streets (allow an increased route
length of say 1/3rd and it will choose the motorway rather than local
routes) -- I'm guessing this will be a much more difficult thing to
implement as it involves messing with the vehicle's routefinding
algorithms....


Oh well, off to install the latest version (o;

Regards
Chris

[Josef Drexler]

Post by Chris
Morning all,
I've been playing with the new one-way roads feature of the patch....
and have the following suggestions - some of which may be easier to
implement than others...
I'm basically using the one way roads to create sort of
motorways/divided highways.
1. Vehicles have a speed advantage of using one way streets - perhaps
+10%
2. Vehicles do not stop overtaking at junctions, tunnels, bridges,
corners, etc!

The problem with all of this, is that one-way roads aren't really
one-way roads, they're only "do not enter" signs at one end of them.
Neither TTD nor the patch nor the vehicles know whether they are on a
one-way road or not, they only know that they're not allowed to enter
this tile from one direction.

Post by Chris
3. Vehicles prefer to use one way streets (allow an increased route
length of say 1/3rd and it will choose the motorway rather than local
routes) -- I'm guessing this will be a much more difficult thing to
implement as it involves messing with the vehicle's routefinding
algorithms....

Well, the pathfinding is really not at all equipped for judging routes
by their "quality". Length is the only variable it keeps internally,
and adding others would be... complicated.

[Chris]

On Wed, 14 Sep 2005 14:56:03 GMT, Josef Drexler

Post by Josef Drexler

Post by Chris
I've been playing with the new one-way roads feature of the patch....

<snip>

Post by Josef Drexler
The problem with all of this, is that one-way roads aren't really
one-way roads, they're only "do not enter" signs at one end of them.
Neither TTD nor the patch nor the vehicles know whether they are on a
one-way road or not, they only know that they're not allowed to enter
this tile from one direction.

Ah, I understand, and see that that might present a problem.... (o;


How, though does TT decide when a road should have pavement and
streetlights? Is there some property of the bit of road that is
flagged to tell it to display this? If so that would make Steve's
suggestion about speed limit of 50kmh in town more feasible to
implement, as the vehicle could just look at the sort of road it
travels along.... it must do something similar with bridges already?
In that case a flag could be added to one way roads to tell the
vehicle the sort of road it travels along....

Which is a load of ifs and buts, and probably wont work anyway!!

Chris (o:

[Stevie D]

Post by Chris
1. Vehicles have a speed advantage of using one way streets - perhaps
+10%

Not sure about that.

What I really _would_ like to see is a speed limit of maybe 30mph /
50km/h in towns (eg any road with pavement). That would provoke a bit
of thought into the best way to build bypasses!

Post by Chris
2. Vehicles do not stop overtaking at junctions, tunnels, bridges,
corners, etc!

That would be helpful.

Post by Chris
3. Vehicles prefer to use one way streets (allow an increased route
length of say 1/3rd and it will choose the motorway rather than local
routes) -- I'm guessing this will be a much more difficult thing to
implement as it involves messing with the vehicle's routefinding
algorithms....

I don't know whether I like that idea. Remember that one-way streets
will be used as much for sorting out congested town centres as
motorways. A better solution, from your point of view, might be to
build complicated interchanges where to turn off the motorway, the
vehicles have to turn through 270 degrees and go back over/under
themselves - this might discourage them from going through the town.

[Chris]

More thoughts....

....I've got to a point now where some of the faster vehicles sit
behind the slower ones on the roads and just cant be bothered to
overtake - they seem to tailgate them and their stats say e.g. 55mph
when the stats for the slower ones say 30mph - even though the road is
straight and had no junctions...

Chris

[Chris]

On Thu, 15 Sep 2005 20:18:47 GMT, Chris

Post by Chris
....I've got to a point now where some of the faster vehicles sit
behind the slower ones on the roads and just cant be bothered to
overtake - they seem to tailgate them and their stats say e.g. 55mph
when the stats for the slower ones say 30mph - even though the road is
straight and had no junctions...

Anyone else with this problem? Or is it something in my configuration
perhaps? I've tried disabling some switches, but it still seems to
occur...

Regards
Chris

[Josef Drexler]

Post by Chris
On Thu, 15 Sep 2005 20:18:47 GMT, Chris

Post by Chris
....I've got to a point now where some of the faster vehicles sit
behind the slower ones on the roads and just cant be bothered to
overtake - they seem to tailgate them and their stats say e.g. 55mph
when the stats for the slower ones say 30mph - even though the road is
straight and had no junctions...

Anyone else with this problem? Or is it something in my configuration
perhaps? I've tried disabling some switches, but it still seems to
occur...

Well, technically all the "onewayroads" switch does is prevent road
vehicles from entering certain tiles from certain directions. As far as
I can tell it does nothing else, so the above must be the same whether
it's on one-way roads or regular roads.

Or are you creating every single road tile as a one-way road? That
might perhaps confuse the RVs, I'm not sure.

[Chris]

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:40:03 GMT, Josef Drexler

Post by Josef Drexler
Well, technically all the "onewayroads" switch does is prevent road
vehicles from entering certain tiles from certain directions. As far as
I can tell it does nothing else, so the above must be the same whether
it's on one-way roads or regular roads.

I think it's definitely someething to do with the one way roads.... as
if I take the one way criteria off the northbound carriageway, they
seem to overtake rather than just sitting behind the slowest.

The thing is, sometimes they do overtake, but sometimes not, and I
can't find any reason why they do/don't.....

Post by Josef Drexler
Or are you creating every single road tile as a one-way road? That
might perhaps confuse the RVs, I'm not sure.

That might explain it.... I have been creating every tile on the
motorway as a one way tile... in case any towns decide to add their
own entrances/exits while I'm not watching.....

*ponder* (!)

Regards,
Chris

[Chris]

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 22:40:00 GMT, Chris

Post by Chris
I think it's definitely someething to do with the one way roads.... as
if I take the one way criteria off the northbound carriageway, they
seem to overtake rather than just sitting behind the slowest.
The thing is, sometimes they do overtake, but sometimes not, and I
can't find any reason why they do/don't.....

Looking at their behaviour on long straights of two way roads, I find
that the only place they don't overtake is when two slow vehicles in
front travelling at the same speed as eachother are spaced
sufficiently far apart to prevent the faster vehicle getting back into
the gap between them - the faster one just then tailgates the slower
one, rather than attempting an overtake... perhaps something similar
is happening if every tile is a one way road tile - the road vehicle
assumes that there isn't anywhere to pull in later...?

Chris

[Josef Drexler]

perhaps something similar is happening if every tile is a one way
road tile - the road vehicle assumes that there isn't anywhere to
pull in later...?

It seems one-way road tiles make the game think it's a junction or
curve, and you can't pass other vehicles across a junction/through a
curve. Bit it should be possible to fix now that I think I know what
the problem is...

[Chris]

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:40:03 GMT, Josef Drexler

Post by Chris
....I've got to a point now where some of the faster vehicles sit
behind the slower ones on the roads and just cant be bothered to
overtake - they seem to tailgate them and their stats say e.g. 55mph
when the stats for the slower ones say 30mph - even though the road is
straight and had no junctions...

Forgot to say, could upload/send you the savegames (before and after)
if it would help...

Chris

[Josef Drexler]

Post by Chris
Forgot to say, could upload/send you the savegames (before and after)
if it would help...

Actually, that would be useful for testing. Savegame+config files
please to the above address (and yes, it's valid).

[Chris]

On Tue, 20 Sep 2005 20:14:03 GMT, Josef Drexler

Post by Josef Drexler

Post by Chris
Forgot to say, could upload/send you the savegames (before and after)
if it would help...

Actually, that would be useful for testing. Savegame+config files
please to the above address (and yes, it's valid).

emailed - if you don't get them, whinge at me!

Thanks
Chris